So...
What's the best activity tied to church to help people grow to love Jesus and learn to live for Him?
What's the minimum requirements for a person to be involved with in their daily life to grow? (I'm thinking spiritual disciplines but feel free)
What's the best venue for transformational discipleship? (SS, small groups, 1 to 1, other?)
How do you discern whether people are growing?
Is there a point when a person shouldn't be in a SS or small group class? A BTDT point? And if so, what for them?
Inquiring minds who are a wee bit fed up with the status quo want to know. I'm developing some thoughts and ideas but really would appreciate some input.
Stream of consciousness answer:
ReplyDeleteBest venue for discipleship? REEEEEEALLY small group -- five or six MAXIMUM, preferably four. Based on the interface between Scripture and REAL LIFE. And I mean REAL real life -- the actual things the four are going through. Walk through it together with the Bible answering the questions.(Incidentally, this was where Jesus did His big stuff -- the inner, inner circle, experiencing life together.)
SS and small groups aren't for discipleship (it doesn't happen there very often) -- SS and small groups are for fellowship a/k/a "stick-ability" a/k/a connection. Expecting more is generally futility. But connection IS important. (Are churches bold enough to make that the primary purpose of those groups?)
Minimum requirements? I don't believe in them. Transformation happens best when it is freely done by the Holy Spirit. Minimum requirements are almost certain to under-emphasize something important for one person and over-emphasize something else. And they become a prison cell for a lot of sincere people. Give them examples and let the Spirit lead in each person's life. Set them free! (I may be radical, but I believe SOME people would be better off with a "quiet time" every three or four days, rather than daily, and others need more than one a day. Let the Spirit lead.)
Best activity TIED TO CHURCH to help them grow to love Jesus and live for Him? See, first paragraph above -- "micro groups?"
How to know if they are growing? Let's be biblical: What fruit are they producing? How do they live? Are they making a positive, eternally-significant difference?
Bill Martin, FBC McMinnville TN
And I replied...
ReplyDeleteSo are the micro groups outside the routine of all the other stuff?
is the idea on Spiritual disciplines to train then let the person find what works for them?
If we continue to do SS and put quarterlies and Bibles in their hands, aren't we running the risk of letting them assume they already got enough and killing the possibility of actual transformational discipleship taking place? (I'm agreeing with you on the connection aspect)
and Bill replied...
ReplyDelete1. The micro groups find their own schedule. Whatever works best -- 6:00 a.m. Tuesday, 4:00 p.m. Sunday, whatever works for those particular people.
2. Yes.
3. SS, as it stands, isn't inherently evil. Maybe it's just a matter of saying, "Hey, this is just the ground level, one-size-fits-all part. If you want to get the most out of this journey, you need to find a mentor and become part of a micro group." One key to the micro group working is that the people involved are actually self-motivated enough to go to the trouble to make it happen. If it's just another obligation/program, it's probably not going to work for them.
yeah. See I'm of the opinion that we already do too much, so adding anything goes against that bias if I don't reduce something.
ReplyDeleteSo you do not have a problem delivering 4 competing messages each week - every single one calling for action - but different action - and delivering content for the trivial file card catalog?
I guess I'm tired of wasting time doing crap for no other reason than "we've always done it", and tired of justifying that which doesn't work for its intended purpose.
I should rename SS "The fellowship hour"?
I like the idea of micro groups (discipleship triads is an idea I've investigated), but something has to DIE.
And Bill replied...
ReplyDeleteI try to do my part to have consistent applications among all my teaching in a given week. For example . . . last Sunday morning was evangelistic (Come to the Light), last Sunday night was exhorting the core to be evangelistic (Lead Them to the Light), and I blew it on Wednesday (Proverbs series).
You're right. The more different applications/activities we call on people to get involved in, the less credible we are. NOBODY can do that much stuff and still live the life God has called us to live! It is an entirely graceless approach. People need the freedom to really live.